JEDDAH, 27 December 2005 — Like all Islamists, 76-year-old Kashmiri leader Syed Ali Shah Geelani is a simple man. He is forthright and speaks his mind with the crystal clarity of an unspoiled Kashmiri lake. That he is a hawk becomes clear in the first five minutes. That he has talons which he uses becomes evident in the next five. He heads his own faction of the All Parties Hurriyat Conference. During the course of an interview with Arab News last week, Geelani frequently quoted the Urdu poet Iqbal to drive his points home with telling effect. You can’t help but notice that 16 years in Indian jails on various charges have not cooled his spirits. “I am very optimistic that Kashmiris will win their much-deserved freedom,” he said. “The only solution to the problem lies in the complete implementation of UN resolutions which call for a plebiscite in the disputed territory. Let Kashmiris decide which way they want to go.” Following are the excerpts from the interview:
Q: Does India’s decision to allow you to come here for Haj indicate a change in policy? We can call it a confidence building measure (CBM), can’t we?
A: I was here for Haj in 1995. Ever since I have been applying to come again for Haj but my requests have always been refused. I completed all formalities but at the last minute, I would be denied the travel documents. No Muslim can deny that once you have visited Makkah and Madinah, you want to go back again and again. This is the wish of every Muslim. This cannot be explained to any non-Muslim. That is why I have been applying to come here again and again. I am happy that I am here. But can it be called a confidence-building measure? No. Allowing an individual to go on Haj cannot fall in the category of CBMs. Till such time as Indian troops leave Kashmir, nothing can be a CBM.
Q: What is your assessment of the situation in Kashmir?
A: The situation is very bad and unfortunately that is not being relayed to the outside world. The one million-strong Indian occupation forces have been given special powers to break into any home and arrest anyone at gunpoint. Our people are tortured and sometimes hot metal rods are thrust into their bodies. India is using brute military force to break the will of the Kashmiri people. Under such circumstances even a faint cry of freedom can — and should — be considered nothing less than a miracle.
Q: The insurgency seems to have died down thanks to the political process set in motion by the governments of India and Pakistan.
A: The battle for freedom in the late 1980s was launched after exhausting all peaceful means of forcing India into accepting UN resolutions that call for conducting a plebiscite in Kashmir. We even fought elections. I myself was in the Jammu and Kashmir Assembly for 15 years. We adopted the democratic process but India paid no attention to solving this dispute by peaceful means. It continued to indulge in political machinations. It bought some people; it suppressed some and killed others. It rejected all peaceful means. The Kashmiri youth were then forced into taking up arms to attain their basic rights. The insurgency was dealt a body blow by renegades within its ranks. They were agent provocateurs. Their numbers ran into thousands. They caused immense harm to the freedom movement. They were a purchasable commodity and were easily bought by the Indian state apparatus.
Q: You seem unhappy about the change in Pakistan’s policy toward Kashmir. Are you?
A: Pakistan always called Kashmir a disputed territory. It always called for a plebiscite. That was the state policy and also that of the people of Pakistan. After Sept. 11, 2001, the military regime (in Pakistan) allowed itself to be pressurized and made changes in its basic policy on Kashmir. Gen. Pervez Musharraf came up with many formulas but India has not responded positively to any of them. For example, Pakistan said it would bypass UN resolutions in search of a solution. India should have welcomed this idea with great enthusiasm but it didn’t. The main stumbling block is the unrealistic Indian attitude. It believes in military might. We have 57 years of experience behind us. India never agreed to solve this issue by talks.
Q: Musharraf says he will accept anything that is acceptable to the people of Kashmir. What was his response when you met him in April during his visit to India?
A: Pakistan has always supported our cause. We have a feeling of gratitude toward that nation and its people for standing with us through thick and thin. It is because of Kashmir that Pakistan was dismembered in 1971...
Q: But Kashmir was not the issue in 1971, was it?
A: It was Kashmir that made India break up Pakistan. The whole idea was to weaken Pakistan. If there had been no Kashmir problem, the tragedy of 1971 would not have happened. Without any fear of contradiction I can say there would have been no Bangladesh. It is all about Kashmir. “Saahebe Nazran Nasha-e-Quwat Hai Khatarnak.” The idea of brute military force is dangerous. Kashmiris have been saddened by the Pakistan government’s changes in its policies. “Bahot dukh huwa hai.” Nothing can rupture our emotional attachment to Pakistan. That will remain but the government’s policies have saddened us.
Q: You lead your own faction of Hurriyat. Are you isolated?
A: You should come there and see if Geelani is isolated or if those who are making a lot of noise are. The split has to do with principles. It is not a question of land. I have no personal enmity against Mirwaiz Umar Farooq. If a caravan started for Haj and some of the members took the route of Somnath (the famous Hindu temple in Gujarat), how could I follow them? In 2002, I was in Ranchi jail. The Hurriyat constituents took part in elections despite the fact that the party’s constitution said otherwise. Then it initiated talks with India. First it spoke to Ram Jethmalani who was then the chairman of the Kashmir Committee. Then it held talks with (L.K.) Advani and then (Atal Behari) Vajpayee and went gaga over them. It was talking to the same people whose hands had been smeared with Muslim blood in Gujarat. People were upset. They realized that the Hurriyat under that leadership was not in sync with the people’s wishes. Our people are determined to achieve their objectives. They don’t want to give in to Indian pressure.
Q: In his interview with Arab News recently Mirwaiz Umar Farooq said the two of you were close to a rapprochement.
A: No way. We have given too much to the movement. The freedom movement has become priceless. In the last 16 years 100,000 men have attained martyrdom. Many women have been raped. Youngsters are still in jail. The other faction of Hurriyat wants to compromise with India. We cannot.
Q: What about the proposal called the United States of Kashmir?
A: (Laughs dismissively). It is a meaningless term. Tell me whose military will be there in those five regions or states. By just changing the name, the ground realities don’t change.
Q: But there will be demilitarization...
A: We want demilitarization. UN resolutions specifically call for India and Pakistan to withdraw their forces from occupied land. Pakistan has to withdraw forces from Azad Kashmir and India should withdraw forces from Jammu and Kashmir. This has been, and still is, our basic demand. But what next after demilitarization? We say give the control to the United Nations so that it can conduct a free and fair plebiscite to implement the resolutions.
Q: It has been repeatedly said that Kashmir’s problem cannot be solved if the parties involved don’t give up on their stated positions. In such a scenario, don’t you think you are too much of an idealist?
A: If the path you have chosen is right, then one has to stand firm. If somebody can convince us that the stand we have taken is not based on historical fact, then we will withdraw. “Aag Uski Phoonk Deti Hai Barna Wo Pir Ko/Laakhon Mein Ek Bhi Ho Agar Saaheb-e-Yaqeen.” If we compromise with India, future generations will not forgive us. About stated positions, let me tell you one thing, Kashmiris want a plebiscite. In 2004 a European Union delegation was in Kashmir and at a press conference at the end of the visit, the delegation described a plebiscite as the best democratic exercise to solve the dispute. It described Kashmir as a beautiful prison. Plebiscite is the only way to determine the wishes of the people of Kashmir. If the majority of Kashmiris decide by free plebiscite to remain with India, we will accept the decision of the majority. If they decide not to, then India and the world community should also accept the decision of the majority. It is simple.
